Search

Bava Batra 85

Want to dedicate learning? Get started here:

podcast placeholder

0:00
0:00




Summary

Today’s daf is sponsored by Tina Lamm. “With hakarat hatov to HKB”H for the zechut of celebrating the 100th birthday of my wonderful father, Mr. Mike Senders of Boca Raton, FL. May he go m’chayil el chayil and continue to enjoy nachat from his children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren, ad me’ah v’esrim shana!”

If an item is placed in the buyer’s vessel, it is acquired by the buyer as a kinyan chatzer (courtyard). But does this depend on whether the vessel was in a private domain or is it effective also in a public domain? Rav and Shmuel hold that is not acquired in the public domain, while Rabbi Yochanan and Reish Lakish hold that it is. However, Rav Pappa says that they do not disagree, as Rabbi Yochanan and Reish Lakish refer to an alleyway and not an actual public domain. A proof is brought from the statement of Rabbi Yochanan. Then the Gemara brings a tannaitic source to suggest that perhaps they could mean a public domain, like the tana in the braita, but that source is explained also to be referring to an alleyway.

Rav Sheshet asks Rav Huna if an item can be acquired by the buyer if it is placed in the buyer’s vessels in the property of the seller? Rav Huna brings three sources to answer the question, but his suggestions are rejected.

Today’s daily daf tools:

Bava Batra 85

כִּלְיוֹ שֶׁל אָדָם קוֹנֶה לוֹ בְּכׇל מָקוֹם, חוּץ מֵרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים. וְרַבִּי יוֹחָנָן וְרַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן לָקִישׁ דְּאָמְרִי תַּרְוַיְיהוּ: אֲפִילּוּ בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים.

A person’s vessels effect acquisition of any item placed inside them for him, in any place in which they are situated, except for the public domain. And Rabbi Yoḥanan and Rabbi Shimon ben Lakish both say: Even in the public domain, one’s vessels effect acquisition of items placed in them.

אָמַר רַב פָּפָּא: לָא פְּלִיגִי; כָּאן בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים, כָּאן בְּסִימְטָא. וְאַמַּאי קָרוּ לַהּ רְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים? שֶׁאֵין רְשׁוּת הַיָּחִיד.

Rav Pappa said: These amora’im do not disagree: Here, when Rav and Shmuel state that one’s vessel does not effect acquisition for him, they are speaking of a vessel placed in the public domain; there, when Rabbi Yoḥanan and Reish Lakish state that his vessel effects acquisition on his behalf, they are referring to a vessel located in an alleyway. And why do they call an alleyway the public domain? The reason is that an alleyway is not a private domain.

הָכִי נָמֵי מִסְתַּבְּרָא, דְּאָמַר רַבִּי אֲבָהוּ אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן: כִּלְיוֹ שֶׁל אָדָם קוֹנֶה לוֹ בְּכׇל מָקוֹם שֶׁיֵּשׁ לוֹ רְשׁוּת לְהַנִּיחוֹ. יֵשׁ לוֹ רְשׁוּת – אִין, אֵין לוֹ רְשׁוּת – לָא. שְׁמַע מִינַּהּ.

The Gemara points out: So, too, it is reasonable to interpret Rabbi Yoḥanan’s statement in this manner, as Rabbi Abbahu says that Rabbi Yoḥanan says: A person’s vessels effect acquisition for him in any place where he has permission to keep them. It can be inferred from here: In a location where he has permission to keep them, yes, his vessels effect acquisition for him. But in a place where he does not have permission to keep his vessels, they do not effect acquisition for him, and one has permission to keep his vessels in an alleyway but not in the public domain. The Gemara affirms: Conclude from this statement that when Rabbi Yoḥanan referred to the public domain he meant an alleyway.

תָּא שְׁמַע, אַרְבַּע מִדּוֹת בַּמּוֹכְרִין: עַד שֶׁלֹּא נִתְמַלְּאָה מִדָּה – לַמּוֹכֵר, מִשֶּׁנִּתְמַלְּאָה מִדָּה – לַלּוֹקֵחַ. בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – בְּמִדָּה שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶן, אֲבָל אִם הָיְתָה מִדָּה שֶׁל אֶחָד מֵהֶן – רִאשׁוֹן רִאשׁוֹן – קָנָה.

The Gemara suggests: Come and hear a difficulty from a baraita: There are four cases with regard to sellers, i.e., four methods through which merchandise is acquired. When the seller measures merchandise for the buyer, before the measuring vessel has been filled the merchandise in the vessel still belongs to the seller and he can change his mind and cancel the sale. Once the measuring vessel has been filled the merchandise belongs to the buyer. In what case is this statement said? It is said when the seller measures with a measuring vessel that does not belong to either of them. But if the measuring vessel belonged to one of them, the buyer acquires the items of sale one by one as they are placed in the measuring vessel.

בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים וּבְחָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶן, אֲבָל בִּרְשׁוּת מוֹכֵר – לֹא קָנָה עַד שֶׁיַּגְבִּיהֶנָּה אוֹ עַד שֶׁיּוֹצִיאֶנָּה מֵרְשׁוּתוֹ. בִּרְשׁוּת לוֹקֵחַ – כֵּיוָן שֶׁקִּבֵּל עָלָיו מוֹכֵר, קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ. בִּרְשׁוּת הַלָּה הַמּוּפְקָדִים אֶצְלוֹ – לֹא קָנָה עַד שֶׁיְּקַבֵּל עָלָיו, אוֹ עַד שֶׁיִּשְׂכּוֹר אֶת מְקוֹמָן.

In what case is this statement said? It is said when the seller measures the items in the public domain or in a courtyard that does not belong to either of them. But if it happens in the domain of the seller, the buyer does not acquire the merchandise until he lifts the measuring vessel or until he moves it out of the domain of the seller. If it is in the domain of the buyer, once the seller accepts upon himself to sell, the buyer acquires it. If the merchandise is located in the domain of this individual with whom it had been deposited, the buyer does not acquire it until the bailee accepts upon himself to designate a place where the merchandise is to be stored for the buyer, or until the buyer rents from the bailee the place where the merchandise is situated.

קָתָנֵי מִיהָא, בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים וּבְחָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶן;

In any event, this baraita teaches with regard to a transaction in the public domain or in a courtyard that does not belong to either of them that if the measuring vessel belonged to one of them, the buyer acquires the items of sale one by one as they are placed in the vessel.

מַאי, לָאו בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים מַמָּשׁ? לָא; סִימְטָא. וְהָא דּוּמְיָא דְּחָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶם קָתָנֵי!

What, is it not stating that a buyer’s vessels effect acquisition of items on his behalf even in the actual public domain, which contradicts Rav Pappa’s explanation? The Gemara answers: No, the baraita is referring to an alleyway, not the actual public domain. The Gemara asks: How can this be what the baraita means? But the baraita teaches that it is similar to a courtyard that does not belong to either of them, i.e., a location to which neither of them have any rights, whereas they both have some rights in an alleyway. Consequently, this must be referring to the actual public domain, not an alleyway.

מַאי ״חָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶם״ נָמֵי – דְּלָא דְּהַאי כּוּלָּהּ וְלָא דְּהַאי כּוּלָּהּ; אֶלָּא דְּתַרְוַיְיהוּ.

The Gemara answers: What is the meaning of the phrase: A courtyard that does not belong to either of them? It also refers to shared property, specifically a courtyard shared by partners, which does not belong to this one entirely and does not belong to that one entirely, but rather it is the property of both of them. Consequently, this courtyard is comparable to an alleyway.

בְּעָא מִינֵּיהּ רַב שֵׁשֶׁת מֵרַב הוּנָא: כִּלְיוֹ שֶׁל לוֹקֵחַ בִּרְשׁוּת מוֹכֵר – קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ, אוֹ לָא? אֲמַר לֵיהּ, תְּנֵיתוּהָ: זְרָקוֹ לָהּ לְתוֹךְ חֵיקָהּ אוֹ לְתוֹךְ קַלְתָּהּ – הֲרֵי זוֹ מְגוֹרֶשֶׁת.

Rav Sheshet raises a dilemma before Rav Huna: If the vessels of the buyer are in the domain of the seller, does the buyer acquire the merchandise once it is placed in his vessels or not? Rav Huna said to him: You learned the answer already in a mishna (Gittin 77a): A wife is divorced when her husband hands her a bill of divorce or places it in a manner that is considered equivalent to handing it to her, e.g., placing in her courtyard. Accordingly, if the husband threw the bill of divorce to her into her lap or into her basket [kaltah], this woman is divorced even if she was in her husband’s domain at that time. By the same token, even if the buyer’s vessels are in the domain of the seller, they effect acquisition of the sold items on his behalf.

אֲמַר לֵיהּ רַב נַחְמָן: מַאי טַעְמָא פָּשְׁטַתְּ לֵיהּ מֵהַהִיא, דְּמָחוּ לַהּ מְאָה עוּכְלֵי בְּעוּכְלָא?

Rav Naḥman said to Rav Huna: What is the reason that you resolved Rav Sheshet’s dilemma from that mishna, which has already been struck with one hundred strikes of a hammer [uklei be’ukela]? In their analysis of this mishna, the Sages have already inserted so many qualifications that it cannot be understood in a straightforward manner.

דְּאָמַר רַב יְהוּדָה אָמַר שְׁמוּאֵל: וְהוּא שֶׁהָיְתָה קַלְתָּהּ תְּלוּיָה בָּהּ. וְרֵישׁ לָקִישׁ אָמַר: קְשׁוּרָה, וְאַף עַל פִּי שֶׁאֵינָהּ תְּלוּיָה בַּהּ. רַב אַדָּא בַּר אַהֲבָה אָמַר: כְּגוֹן שֶׁהָיְתָה קַלְתָּהּ מוּנַּחַת לָהּ בֵּין יַרְכוֹתֶיהָ. רַב מְשַׁרְשְׁיָא בְּרֵיהּ דְּרַבִּי אַמֵּי אָמַר: כְּגוֹן שֶׁהָיָה בַּעְלָהּ מוֹכֵר קְלָתוֹת.

As Rav Yehuda says that Shmuel says: This halakha of the mishna in Gittin applies only if her basket was hanging from her body, so that it is considered on her or in her hand. And Reish Lakish says: It is sufficient if it was tied to her, even though it is not hanging from her, but resting on the ground. Rav Adda bar Ahava says: The mishna is referring to a case where her basket was placed between her thighs. Although it is not hanging from her, since it is placed on her body it serves to acquire the bill of divorce on her behalf. Rav Mesharshiyya, son of Rabbi Ami, says: This is referring to a case where her husband was a basket seller. Since he is not particular about the place where the basket into which he placed the bill of divorce is located, as his entire courtyard is full of baskets, it is considered as though he expressly granted her the right to make use of its location.

רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן אָמַר: מְקוֹם חֵיקָהּ קָנוּי לָהּ, מְקוֹם קַלְתָּהּ קָנוּי לָהּ. אָמַר רָבָא: מַאי טַעְמָא דְּרַבִּי יוֹחָנָן? לְפִי שֶׁאֵין אָדָם מַקְפִּיד לֹא עַל מְקוֹם חֵיקָהּ וְלֹא עַל מְקוֹם קַלְתָּהּ.

Rabbi Yoḥanan says: The place of her lap, i.e., the place within her husband’s property where she stands or sits, belongs to her, and the place of her basket is acquired to her. Rava said: What is the reason behind the statement of Rabbi Yoḥanan? It is because a person, including a husband, is not particular neither about the place of her lap nor about the place of her basket, as she requires these areas and they do not take up much space. It is evident from all of these qualifications that one cannot infer a halakhic principle from here with regard to a buyer’s vessels in a seller’s domain.

אֶלָּא פְּשׁוֹט לָהּ מֵהָא: בִּרְשׁוּת מוֹכֵר – לֹא קָנָה עַד שֶׁיַּגְבִּיהֶנָּה אוֹ עַד שֶׁיּוֹצִיאֶנָּה מֵרְשׁוּתוֹ. מַאי, לָאו בְּכִלְיוֹ דְלוֹקֵחַ? לֹא, בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר.

Rather, resolve the dilemma from that which was taught in a baraita: If the merchandise was in the domain of a seller, the buyer does not acquire the merchandise until he lifts it or until he removes it from the domain of the seller. What, is it not referring to merchandise placed in the vessels of the buyer, which proves that the buyer’s vessels do not effect acquisition of the merchandise on his behalf when they are in the seller’s domain? The Gemara answers: No, this does not serve as proof, as it is referring to merchandise placed in the vessels of the seller. That is why the buyer must lift or pull the merchandise to acquire it.

וּמִדְּרֵישָׁא בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר – סֵיפָא נָמֵי בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר; אֵימָא סֵיפָא: בִּרְשׁוּת לוֹקֵחַ, כֵּיוָן שֶׁקִּיבֵּל עָלָיו מוֹכֵר – קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ. וְאִי בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר, אַמַּאי קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ? סֵיפָא אֲתָאן לְכִלְיוֹ דְלוֹקֵחַ.

The Gemara asks: But from the fact that the first clause is referring to the vessels of the seller, as currently understood, the latter clause must also be referring to the vessels of the seller. Say the latter clause: If the merchandise was in the domain of the buyer, once the seller accepts upon himself to sell an item, the buyer acquires it. And if this is referring to merchandise in the vessels of the seller, as in the earlier clause, why does the buyer acquire it? The Gemara answers: In the latter clause, we come to a different scenario, which involves the vessels of the buyer.

וּמַאי פַּסְקָא? סְתָמָא דְמִילְּתָא, בֵּי מוֹכֵר – מָאנֵי דְמוֹכֵר שְׁכִיחִי, בֵּי לוֹקֵחַ – מָאנֵי דְלוֹקֵחַ שְׁכִיחִי.

The Gemara asks: But if the clauses of the baraita are addressing different cases, why was it stated without qualification? The Gemara answers: The normal way of things is that in the house of the seller the vessels of the seller are commonly found, and in the house of the buyer the vessels of the buyer are commonly found. In sum, the dilemma cannot be resolved from the baraita.

אָמַר רָבָא, תָּא שְׁמַע: מָשַׁךְ חֲמָרָיו וּפוֹעֲלָיו, וְהִכְנִיסָן לְתוֹךְ בֵּיתוֹ; בֵּין פָּסַק עַד שֶׁלֹּא מָדַד, וּבֵין מָדַד עַד שֶׁלֹּא פָּסַק – שְׁנֵיהֶן יְכוֹלִין לַחֲזוֹר בָּהֶן.

Rava said: Come and hear a resolution from a baraita: If one pulled his donkey drivers, thereby dragging along with them the donkeys laden with goods, and likewise, if he pulled his laborers, who were carrying merchandise he wished to purchase, and he brought them into his house, whether he fixed a price before he measured the merchandise or whether he measured before fixing a price, both parties can renege on the sale, provided that the merchandise has not been unloaded from the laborers or the donkeys.

Today’s daily daf tools:

Delve Deeper

Broaden your understanding of the topics on this daf with classes and podcasts from top women Talmud scholars.

For the Beyond the Daf shiurim offered in Hebrew, see here.

New to Talmud?

Check out our resources designed to help you navigate a page of Talmud – and study at the pace, level and style that fits you. 

The Hadran Women’s Tapestry

Meet the diverse women learning Gemara at Hadran and hear their stories. 

Jill Shames
Jill Shames

Jerusalem, Israel

I decided to give daf yomi a try when I heard about the siyum hashas in 2020. Once the pandemic hit, the daily commitment gave my days some much-needed structure. There have been times when I’ve felt like quitting- especially when encountering very technical details in the text. But then I tell myself, “Look how much you’ve done. You can’t stop now!” So I keep going & my Koren bookshelf grows…

Miriam Eckstein-Koas
Miriam Eckstein-Koas

Huntington, United States

I was exposed to Talmud in high school, but I was truly inspired after my daughter and I decided to attend the Women’s Siyum Shas in 2020. We knew that this was a historic moment. We were blown away, overcome with emotion at the euphoria of the revolution. Right then, I knew I would continue. My commitment deepened with the every-morning Virtual Beit Midrash on Zoom with R. Michelle.

Adina Hagege
Adina Hagege

Zichron Yaakov, Israel

A friend mentioned that she was starting Daf Yomi in January 2020. I had heard of it and thought, why not? I decided to try it – go day by day and not think about the seven plus year commitment. Fast forward today, over two years in and I can’t imagine my life without Daf Yomi. It’s part of my morning ritual. If I have a busy day ahead of me I set my alarm to get up early to finish the day’s daf
Debbie Fitzerman
Debbie Fitzerman

Ontario, Canada

I’ve been wanting to do Daf Yomi for years, but always wanted to start at the beginning and not in the middle of things. When the opportunity came in 2020, I decided: “this is now the time!” I’ve been posting my journey daily on social media, tracking my progress (#DafYomi); now it’s fully integrated into my daily routines. I’ve also inspired my partner to join, too!

Joséphine Altzman
Joséphine Altzman

Teaneck, United States

I tried Daf Yomi in the middle of the last cycle after realizing I could listen to Michelle’s shiurim online. It lasted all of 2 days! Then the new cycle started just days before my father’s first yahrzeit and my youngest daughter’s bat mitzvah. It seemed the right time for a new beginning. My family, friends, colleagues are immensely supportive!

Catriella-Freedman-jpeg
Catriella Freedman

Zichron Yaakov, Israel

When the new cycle began, I thought, If not now, when? I’d just turned 72. I feel like a tourist on a tour bus passing astonishing scenery each day. Rabbanit Michelle is my beloved tour guide. When the cycle ends, I’ll be 80. I pray that I’ll have strength and mind to continue the journey to glimpse a little more. My grandchildren think having a daf-learning savta is cool!

Wendy Dickstein
Wendy Dickstein

Jerusalem, Israel

I’ve been learning since January 2020, and in June I started drawing a phrase from each daf. Sometimes it’s easy (e.g. plants), sometimes it’s very hard (e.g. korbanot), and sometimes it’s loads of fun (e.g. bird racing) to find something to draw. I upload my pictures from each masechet to #DafYomiArt. I am enjoying every step of the journey.

Gila Loike
Gila Loike

Ashdod, Israel

I started learning at the beginning of this cycle more than 2 years ago, and I have not missed a day or a daf. It’s been challenging and enlightening and even mind-numbing at times, but the learning and the shared experience have all been worth it. If you are open to it, there’s no telling what might come into your life.

Patti Evans
Patti Evans

Phoenix, Arizona, United States

I read Ilana Kurshan’s “If All the Seas Were Ink” which inspired me. Then the Women’s Siyum in Jerusalem in 2020 convinced me, I knew I had to join! I have loved it- it’s been a constant in my life daily, many of the sugiyot connect to our lives. My family and friends all are so supportive. It’s incredible being part of this community and love how diverse it is! I am so excited to learn more!

Shira Jacobowitz
Shira Jacobowitz

Jerusalem, Israel

I started learning Talmud with R’ Haramati in Yeshivah of Flatbush. But after a respite of 60 years, Rabbanit Michelle lit my fire – after attending the last three world siyumim in Miami Beach, Meadowlands and Boca Raton, and now that I’m retired, I decided – “I can do this!” It has been an incredible journey so far, and I look forward to learning Daf everyday – Mazal Tov to everyone!

Roslyn Jaffe
Roslyn Jaffe

Florida, United States

A few years back, after reading Ilana Kurshan’s book, “If All The Seas Were Ink,” I began pondering the crazy, outlandish idea of beginning the Daf Yomi cycle. Beginning in December, 2019, a month before the previous cycle ended, I “auditioned” 30 different podcasts in 30 days, and ultimately chose to take the plunge with Hadran and Rabbanit Michelle. Such joy!

Cindy Dolgin
Cindy Dolgin

HUNTINGTON, United States

Robin Zeiger
Robin Zeiger

Tel Aviv, Israel

I started learning at the beginning of this Daf Yomi cycle because I heard a lot about the previous cycle coming to an end and thought it would be a good thing to start doing. My husband had already bought several of the Koren Talmud Bavli books and they were just sitting on the shelf, not being used, so here was an opportunity to start using them and find out exactly what was in them. Loving it!

Caroline Levison
Caroline Levison

Borehamwood, United Kingdom

What a great experience to learn with Rabbanit Michelle Farber. I began with this cycle in January 2020 and have been comforted by the consistency and energy of this process throughout the isolation period of Covid. Week by week, I feel like I am exploring a treasure chest with sparkling gems and puzzling antiquities. The hunt is exhilarating.

Marian Frankston
Marian Frankston

Pennsylvania, United States

I was moved to tears by the Hadran Siyyum HaShas. I have learned Torah all my life, but never connected to learning Gemara on a regular basis until then. Seeing the sheer joy Talmud Torah at the siyyum, I felt compelled to be part of it, and I haven’t missed a day!
It’s not always easy, but it is so worthwhile, and it has strengthened my love of learning. It is part of my life now.

Michelle Lewis
Michelle Lewis

Beit Shemesh, Israel

A friend mentioned that she was starting Daf Yomi in January 2020. I had heard of it and thought, why not? I decided to try it – go day by day and not think about the seven plus year commitment. Fast forward today, over two years in and I can’t imagine my life without Daf Yomi. It’s part of my morning ritual. If I have a busy day ahead of me I set my alarm to get up early to finish the day’s daf
Debbie Fitzerman
Debbie Fitzerman

Ontario, Canada

I tried Daf Yomi in the middle of the last cycle after realizing I could listen to Michelle’s shiurim online. It lasted all of 2 days! Then the new cycle started just days before my father’s first yahrzeit and my youngest daughter’s bat mitzvah. It seemed the right time for a new beginning. My family, friends, colleagues are immensely supportive!

Catriella-Freedman-jpeg
Catriella Freedman

Zichron Yaakov, Israel

I began learning the daf in January 2022. I initially “flew under the radar,” sharing my journey with my husband and a few close friends. I was apprehensive – who, me? Gemara? Now, 2 years in, I feel changed. The rigor of a daily commitment frames my days. The intellectual engagement enhances my knowledge. And the virtual community of learners has become a new family, weaving a glorious tapestry.

Gitta Jaroslawicz-Neufeld
Gitta Jaroslawicz-Neufeld

Far Rockaway, United States

I began learning with Rabbanit Michelle’s wonderful Talmud Skills class on Pesachim, which really enriched my Pesach seder, and I have been learning Daf Yomi off and on over the past year. Because I’m relatively new at this, there is a “chiddush” for me every time I learn, and the knowledge and insights of the group members add so much to my experience. I feel very lucky to be a part of this.

Julie-Landau-Photo
Julie Landau

Karmiel, Israel

Bava Batra 85

כִּלְיוֹ שֶׁל אָדָם קוֹנֶה לוֹ בְּכׇל מָקוֹם, חוּץ מֵרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים. וְרַבִּי יוֹחָנָן וְרַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן לָקִישׁ דְּאָמְרִי תַּרְוַיְיהוּ: אֲפִילּוּ בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים.

A person’s vessels effect acquisition of any item placed inside them for him, in any place in which they are situated, except for the public domain. And Rabbi Yoḥanan and Rabbi Shimon ben Lakish both say: Even in the public domain, one’s vessels effect acquisition of items placed in them.

אָמַר רַב פָּפָּא: לָא פְּלִיגִי; כָּאן בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים, כָּאן בְּסִימְטָא. וְאַמַּאי קָרוּ לַהּ רְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים? שֶׁאֵין רְשׁוּת הַיָּחִיד.

Rav Pappa said: These amora’im do not disagree: Here, when Rav and Shmuel state that one’s vessel does not effect acquisition for him, they are speaking of a vessel placed in the public domain; there, when Rabbi Yoḥanan and Reish Lakish state that his vessel effects acquisition on his behalf, they are referring to a vessel located in an alleyway. And why do they call an alleyway the public domain? The reason is that an alleyway is not a private domain.

הָכִי נָמֵי מִסְתַּבְּרָא, דְּאָמַר רַבִּי אֲבָהוּ אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן: כִּלְיוֹ שֶׁל אָדָם קוֹנֶה לוֹ בְּכׇל מָקוֹם שֶׁיֵּשׁ לוֹ רְשׁוּת לְהַנִּיחוֹ. יֵשׁ לוֹ רְשׁוּת – אִין, אֵין לוֹ רְשׁוּת – לָא. שְׁמַע מִינַּהּ.

The Gemara points out: So, too, it is reasonable to interpret Rabbi Yoḥanan’s statement in this manner, as Rabbi Abbahu says that Rabbi Yoḥanan says: A person’s vessels effect acquisition for him in any place where he has permission to keep them. It can be inferred from here: In a location where he has permission to keep them, yes, his vessels effect acquisition for him. But in a place where he does not have permission to keep his vessels, they do not effect acquisition for him, and one has permission to keep his vessels in an alleyway but not in the public domain. The Gemara affirms: Conclude from this statement that when Rabbi Yoḥanan referred to the public domain he meant an alleyway.

תָּא שְׁמַע, אַרְבַּע מִדּוֹת בַּמּוֹכְרִין: עַד שֶׁלֹּא נִתְמַלְּאָה מִדָּה – לַמּוֹכֵר, מִשֶּׁנִּתְמַלְּאָה מִדָּה – לַלּוֹקֵחַ. בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – בְּמִדָּה שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶן, אֲבָל אִם הָיְתָה מִדָּה שֶׁל אֶחָד מֵהֶן – רִאשׁוֹן רִאשׁוֹן – קָנָה.

The Gemara suggests: Come and hear a difficulty from a baraita: There are four cases with regard to sellers, i.e., four methods through which merchandise is acquired. When the seller measures merchandise for the buyer, before the measuring vessel has been filled the merchandise in the vessel still belongs to the seller and he can change his mind and cancel the sale. Once the measuring vessel has been filled the merchandise belongs to the buyer. In what case is this statement said? It is said when the seller measures with a measuring vessel that does not belong to either of them. But if the measuring vessel belonged to one of them, the buyer acquires the items of sale one by one as they are placed in the measuring vessel.

בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים וּבְחָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶן, אֲבָל בִּרְשׁוּת מוֹכֵר – לֹא קָנָה עַד שֶׁיַּגְבִּיהֶנָּה אוֹ עַד שֶׁיּוֹצִיאֶנָּה מֵרְשׁוּתוֹ. בִּרְשׁוּת לוֹקֵחַ – כֵּיוָן שֶׁקִּבֵּל עָלָיו מוֹכֵר, קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ. בִּרְשׁוּת הַלָּה הַמּוּפְקָדִים אֶצְלוֹ – לֹא קָנָה עַד שֶׁיְּקַבֵּל עָלָיו, אוֹ עַד שֶׁיִּשְׂכּוֹר אֶת מְקוֹמָן.

In what case is this statement said? It is said when the seller measures the items in the public domain or in a courtyard that does not belong to either of them. But if it happens in the domain of the seller, the buyer does not acquire the merchandise until he lifts the measuring vessel or until he moves it out of the domain of the seller. If it is in the domain of the buyer, once the seller accepts upon himself to sell, the buyer acquires it. If the merchandise is located in the domain of this individual with whom it had been deposited, the buyer does not acquire it until the bailee accepts upon himself to designate a place where the merchandise is to be stored for the buyer, or until the buyer rents from the bailee the place where the merchandise is situated.

קָתָנֵי מִיהָא, בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים וּבְחָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶן;

In any event, this baraita teaches with regard to a transaction in the public domain or in a courtyard that does not belong to either of them that if the measuring vessel belonged to one of them, the buyer acquires the items of sale one by one as they are placed in the vessel.

מַאי, לָאו בִּרְשׁוּת הָרַבִּים מַמָּשׁ? לָא; סִימְטָא. וְהָא דּוּמְיָא דְּחָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶם קָתָנֵי!

What, is it not stating that a buyer’s vessels effect acquisition of items on his behalf even in the actual public domain, which contradicts Rav Pappa’s explanation? The Gemara answers: No, the baraita is referring to an alleyway, not the actual public domain. The Gemara asks: How can this be what the baraita means? But the baraita teaches that it is similar to a courtyard that does not belong to either of them, i.e., a location to which neither of them have any rights, whereas they both have some rights in an alleyway. Consequently, this must be referring to the actual public domain, not an alleyway.

מַאי ״חָצֵר שֶׁאֵינָהּ שֶׁל שְׁנֵיהֶם״ נָמֵי – דְּלָא דְּהַאי כּוּלָּהּ וְלָא דְּהַאי כּוּלָּהּ; אֶלָּא דְּתַרְוַיְיהוּ.

The Gemara answers: What is the meaning of the phrase: A courtyard that does not belong to either of them? It also refers to shared property, specifically a courtyard shared by partners, which does not belong to this one entirely and does not belong to that one entirely, but rather it is the property of both of them. Consequently, this courtyard is comparable to an alleyway.

בְּעָא מִינֵּיהּ רַב שֵׁשֶׁת מֵרַב הוּנָא: כִּלְיוֹ שֶׁל לוֹקֵחַ בִּרְשׁוּת מוֹכֵר – קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ, אוֹ לָא? אֲמַר לֵיהּ, תְּנֵיתוּהָ: זְרָקוֹ לָהּ לְתוֹךְ חֵיקָהּ אוֹ לְתוֹךְ קַלְתָּהּ – הֲרֵי זוֹ מְגוֹרֶשֶׁת.

Rav Sheshet raises a dilemma before Rav Huna: If the vessels of the buyer are in the domain of the seller, does the buyer acquire the merchandise once it is placed in his vessels or not? Rav Huna said to him: You learned the answer already in a mishna (Gittin 77a): A wife is divorced when her husband hands her a bill of divorce or places it in a manner that is considered equivalent to handing it to her, e.g., placing in her courtyard. Accordingly, if the husband threw the bill of divorce to her into her lap or into her basket [kaltah], this woman is divorced even if she was in her husband’s domain at that time. By the same token, even if the buyer’s vessels are in the domain of the seller, they effect acquisition of the sold items on his behalf.

אֲמַר לֵיהּ רַב נַחְמָן: מַאי טַעְמָא פָּשְׁטַתְּ לֵיהּ מֵהַהִיא, דְּמָחוּ לַהּ מְאָה עוּכְלֵי בְּעוּכְלָא?

Rav Naḥman said to Rav Huna: What is the reason that you resolved Rav Sheshet’s dilemma from that mishna, which has already been struck with one hundred strikes of a hammer [uklei be’ukela]? In their analysis of this mishna, the Sages have already inserted so many qualifications that it cannot be understood in a straightforward manner.

דְּאָמַר רַב יְהוּדָה אָמַר שְׁמוּאֵל: וְהוּא שֶׁהָיְתָה קַלְתָּהּ תְּלוּיָה בָּהּ. וְרֵישׁ לָקִישׁ אָמַר: קְשׁוּרָה, וְאַף עַל פִּי שֶׁאֵינָהּ תְּלוּיָה בַּהּ. רַב אַדָּא בַּר אַהֲבָה אָמַר: כְּגוֹן שֶׁהָיְתָה קַלְתָּהּ מוּנַּחַת לָהּ בֵּין יַרְכוֹתֶיהָ. רַב מְשַׁרְשְׁיָא בְּרֵיהּ דְּרַבִּי אַמֵּי אָמַר: כְּגוֹן שֶׁהָיָה בַּעְלָהּ מוֹכֵר קְלָתוֹת.

As Rav Yehuda says that Shmuel says: This halakha of the mishna in Gittin applies only if her basket was hanging from her body, so that it is considered on her or in her hand. And Reish Lakish says: It is sufficient if it was tied to her, even though it is not hanging from her, but resting on the ground. Rav Adda bar Ahava says: The mishna is referring to a case where her basket was placed between her thighs. Although it is not hanging from her, since it is placed on her body it serves to acquire the bill of divorce on her behalf. Rav Mesharshiyya, son of Rabbi Ami, says: This is referring to a case where her husband was a basket seller. Since he is not particular about the place where the basket into which he placed the bill of divorce is located, as his entire courtyard is full of baskets, it is considered as though he expressly granted her the right to make use of its location.

רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן אָמַר: מְקוֹם חֵיקָהּ קָנוּי לָהּ, מְקוֹם קַלְתָּהּ קָנוּי לָהּ. אָמַר רָבָא: מַאי טַעְמָא דְּרַבִּי יוֹחָנָן? לְפִי שֶׁאֵין אָדָם מַקְפִּיד לֹא עַל מְקוֹם חֵיקָהּ וְלֹא עַל מְקוֹם קַלְתָּהּ.

Rabbi Yoḥanan says: The place of her lap, i.e., the place within her husband’s property where she stands or sits, belongs to her, and the place of her basket is acquired to her. Rava said: What is the reason behind the statement of Rabbi Yoḥanan? It is because a person, including a husband, is not particular neither about the place of her lap nor about the place of her basket, as she requires these areas and they do not take up much space. It is evident from all of these qualifications that one cannot infer a halakhic principle from here with regard to a buyer’s vessels in a seller’s domain.

אֶלָּא פְּשׁוֹט לָהּ מֵהָא: בִּרְשׁוּת מוֹכֵר – לֹא קָנָה עַד שֶׁיַּגְבִּיהֶנָּה אוֹ עַד שֶׁיּוֹצִיאֶנָּה מֵרְשׁוּתוֹ. מַאי, לָאו בְּכִלְיוֹ דְלוֹקֵחַ? לֹא, בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר.

Rather, resolve the dilemma from that which was taught in a baraita: If the merchandise was in the domain of a seller, the buyer does not acquire the merchandise until he lifts it or until he removes it from the domain of the seller. What, is it not referring to merchandise placed in the vessels of the buyer, which proves that the buyer’s vessels do not effect acquisition of the merchandise on his behalf when they are in the seller’s domain? The Gemara answers: No, this does not serve as proof, as it is referring to merchandise placed in the vessels of the seller. That is why the buyer must lift or pull the merchandise to acquire it.

וּמִדְּרֵישָׁא בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר – סֵיפָא נָמֵי בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר; אֵימָא סֵיפָא: בִּרְשׁוּת לוֹקֵחַ, כֵּיוָן שֶׁקִּיבֵּל עָלָיו מוֹכֵר – קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ. וְאִי בְּכִלְיוֹ דְמוֹכֵר, אַמַּאי קָנָה לוֹקֵחַ? סֵיפָא אֲתָאן לְכִלְיוֹ דְלוֹקֵחַ.

The Gemara asks: But from the fact that the first clause is referring to the vessels of the seller, as currently understood, the latter clause must also be referring to the vessels of the seller. Say the latter clause: If the merchandise was in the domain of the buyer, once the seller accepts upon himself to sell an item, the buyer acquires it. And if this is referring to merchandise in the vessels of the seller, as in the earlier clause, why does the buyer acquire it? The Gemara answers: In the latter clause, we come to a different scenario, which involves the vessels of the buyer.

וּמַאי פַּסְקָא? סְתָמָא דְמִילְּתָא, בֵּי מוֹכֵר – מָאנֵי דְמוֹכֵר שְׁכִיחִי, בֵּי לוֹקֵחַ – מָאנֵי דְלוֹקֵחַ שְׁכִיחִי.

The Gemara asks: But if the clauses of the baraita are addressing different cases, why was it stated without qualification? The Gemara answers: The normal way of things is that in the house of the seller the vessels of the seller are commonly found, and in the house of the buyer the vessels of the buyer are commonly found. In sum, the dilemma cannot be resolved from the baraita.

אָמַר רָבָא, תָּא שְׁמַע: מָשַׁךְ חֲמָרָיו וּפוֹעֲלָיו, וְהִכְנִיסָן לְתוֹךְ בֵּיתוֹ; בֵּין פָּסַק עַד שֶׁלֹּא מָדַד, וּבֵין מָדַד עַד שֶׁלֹּא פָּסַק – שְׁנֵיהֶן יְכוֹלִין לַחֲזוֹר בָּהֶן.

Rava said: Come and hear a resolution from a baraita: If one pulled his donkey drivers, thereby dragging along with them the donkeys laden with goods, and likewise, if he pulled his laborers, who were carrying merchandise he wished to purchase, and he brought them into his house, whether he fixed a price before he measured the merchandise or whether he measured before fixing a price, both parties can renege on the sale, provided that the merchandise has not been unloaded from the laborers or the donkeys.

Want to follow content and continue where you left off?

Create an account today to track your progress, mark what you’ve learned, and follow the shiurim that speak to you.

Clear all items from this list?

This will remove ALL the items in this section. You will lose any progress or history connected to them. This is irreversible.

Cancel
Yes, clear all

Are you sure you want to delete this item?

You will lose any progress or history connected to this item.

Cancel
Yes, delete